Keeping watch on Trendwest / WorldMark by Wyndham

Wednesday, April 27, 2005

Free exchange companies?

In posting an anonymous comment, a reader mentioned:


So bottom line you can join some free exchange places and grab a bonus week for next to nothing, bonus nights with Trendwest for $60 night, pay exchange costs and hope for a flexchange with Interval and you will have a bargain. But it is hard work unless like me you enjoy it!


I'm intrigued! Do you have any examples of "free exchange places"? I'd love to hear more about what you've discovered!

-- Fabbo

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Royale Timeshare

A reader passed along a link to Royale Timeshare which lists all sorts of timeshares for re-sale.

After looking at their stocklist, it becomes pretty obvious that WorldMark is a better alternative than traditional timeshares that have fixed weeks for holidays at fixed resorts.

Why anyone buy into such a property is a mystery to me.

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Tuesday, April 26, 2005

Local WMSP Owners Club

An online user group for WorldMark South Pacific owners has been created on Yahoo and is accessible at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WMSP.

It has been started by Jim Kellog, a local WMSP unitholder who, according to his e-mail signature, has visited the following countries:
  • Austria
  • Canada
  • Channel Islands
  • Czech Republic
  • England
  • Germany
  • Hong Kong x3
  • Japan
  • Kenya
  • Mexico x5+
  • Netherlands
  • New Zealand x3
  • Norfolk Island
  • Philippines
  • Poland
  • Tahiti
  • Taiwan
  • USA-Hawaii x3
  • USA-Mainland x10+ (40+ states)
  • Vanuatu
If this means that Jim has visited a WorldMark (or partner) resort in each of these locations, then he has had 40+ holidays. All that with only 20,000 credits per year seems pretty remarkable. Perhaps you'd like to comment, Jim?

Anyway, the WMSP group on Yahoo is yet another place to discuss WorldMark and share information amongst members. For example, Jim points out that maintenance fees increased 3% last year and housekeeping fees 15%. It's good to have somebody policing such information!

I also note that Jim has an eBay auction for 1000 credits with a starting price of $80. These credits can be transferred to another WorldMark South Pacific owner to "top-up" their points balance (unlike 'renting' which is a way of selling time to non-unitholders).

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Monday, April 25, 2005

Congratulations Ronnie and Mouse!

Congratulations to eBay user ronnieandmouse who successfully sold 6000 units on eBay auction #6526404742 for $6,200. The seller is paying the transfer fee.

Bidding was short and sweet, with xtraspesch placing a bid of $6,100 only 45 minutes before the end of the 7-day auction, which was outbid by joma5461 with less than 5 minutes of the auction remaining!

This emphasises that the second-hand market for WorldMark South Pacific only seems to be worth $1/unit. Perhaps this will improve as more people understand the concept.

Meanwhile, I've received this query from a reader:
Anyone know if you can buy a small amount of points and then as a member convert red weeks from other timeshares to Trendwest credits? I am trying to find out and will post what I find... kras7

It sounds like they want to do a bit of trickery to gain an advantage. I don't understand the details, but post a comment if you can help!

-- Fabbo

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Tuesday, April 19, 2005

Straight on the money

Straight and simple -- eBay auction #6526404742 has 6000 credits going for $6,000 with 12,000 available credits, and they'll even pay the $200 transfer fee.

I wrote to the seller and asked them why they are selling. They said:

I have no experience of Trendwest/WorldMark we are always unable to commite to dates due to work,which is why we are selling the membership.


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What to ask Trendwest

I received this e-mail from a reader:
i just received one of those very friendly phonecalls from Trendwest this morning and i doubt i'll be attending thursday night's 'presentation' after all the things i've been reading up about Trendwest. As much as it wouldve been nice to 'win' a holiday, maybe i wasnt really winning anything at all. Just a question - do i still need to attend their presentation if i choose the stereo system instead of a holiday. :o) ?

Yes, you have to attend the 90-minute session to get the free gift. The gift can be chosen from a DVD player, stereo or holiday -- however, there are "administration fees" attached to the holiday and decisions about where/when to go. I normally suggest taking the "known" against the "unknown".

My recommendation is to attend the session (given enough time) and be open and honest about asking them questions.

Get their assistance in calculating the "value" of the holiday and see if it all adds up to the value they are offering -- then let me know how it went!

If you want, you can save two questions until the very end:
  1. How does Trendwest assist owners in selling their units?
  2. Why are there regular listings on eBay for $1.00 to $1.20/unit, compared to $2.08 to purchase direct from Trendwest?
That last one should get some panic going!

-- Fabbo

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Monday, April 18, 2005

Australian re-sales service

Some of you might recall my monitoring of an eBay auction by tlcbusconsult, who seemed to be buying AND selling credits.

I've since received the following information from them:
Hi Fabbo,

You emailed me a while ago regarding my ebay ad for Trendwest memberships - as I mentioned at the time I was working on a business deal and I can now let you in on the details. I am now the official Australian agent for Redseason.com and we will be launching our Australian website in the next week or so but it is already up on the web so you can have a sneak preview. The web address is www.redseason.com.au

Redseason.com is the leading reseller of Trendwest packages in America due to their great service and focus on customer satisfaction (for both buyers and sellers) and we aim to bring the same high level of service to the Australian resale market with our new site. Some of the advantages of buying a membership through us include:
  • All memberships are Premier memberships and our pricing is fully inclusive of all transfer fees, etc.
  • All memberships are guaranteed to be fully paid for and the levies are paid in full up to the current quarter.
  • We offer a risk-free (and hastle-free) transfer process which means you don't have to pay anything until you are satisfied the membership is ready to transfer.
  • We have an excellent working relationship with the transfer department at Trendwest which means we can help you through the sale process.
  • All our staff are Worldmark or Worldmark South Pacific owners so we KNOW the answers to any questions you may have.
  • Our motto is "We will do whatever it takes to make sure you are 100% comfortable." Making sure the buyer is happy and comfortable during all stages of the buying process is our number one goal so we are always happy to answer any questions a buyer (or prospective buyer) may have.
Personally I am a very happy owner of a Worldmark South Pacific membership and have had great holidays in Fiji and Kirra Beach (Gold Coast) whilst my brother has taken advantage of my membership for a holiday at the Cairns resort and he was also extremely happy with his holiday. When I have some more time I will send you my own analysis of the value of a Trendwest membership as compared to renting holiday accommodation in the normal way.
Please have a look at the website and let me know what you think. If you have any questions at all please email or call me. I am happy for you to post a copy of this email on your website.

Regards,

Terry Bradford
Redseason.com.au
Phone: 0412 837792
Well, it's good to see more opportunities for local unitholders to sell their holding. As always, every buyer & seller should carefully look into the price & conditions of the sale.

One definite advantage of having an agent is that they know all the details -- they can ensure that credits and points are appropriately transferred and will, no doubt, ensure that payment is properly transferred between parties. The downside? Okay, they'll take a percentage but that's the cost of business. There's always eBay if their value does not justify their fees.

I notice that Terry has already put a listing on eBay (#6526031970) with 6000 credits going for a $7,200 opening bid. That's $1.20/unit and they even pay the $200 transfer fee. That looks like a reasonable market price, especially given the value of an experienced agent.

More interesting, the information on his website explains that they purchase points up-front for a stated price. This is much better than an auction because you know what you're getting and there's no waiting. However, be prepared for them to take a "margin" out of that price -- that's their income! (Plus, if they're lucky, they can get a bidding war on eBay and earn even more.)

Oh, and I notice that their eBay ID has changed from tlcbusconsult to redseason_com_au.

All in all, it's a positive step for both buyers and sellers. Good luck, Terry!

-- Fabbo

(Disclaimer: I've got nothing to do with Terry or Redseason. I only just found out his name from that e-mail!)

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Thursday, April 14, 2005

A question on transferring points

This came in from a reader:
Fabbo
Still following your interesting site.

I have one question which is quite important. From my reading of the
PDS, premier points are only available at a presentation. What happens
to points purchased from ebay (or other) and transferred? Do they remain
premier points (even though not obtained at a presentation) or are they
converted to standard? It appears that trendwest have final approval on
this. I can see that if you already own units and purchase more from
ebay then they would probably retain premier status, but what happens if
your first purchases are from ebay??? What experience have people had on
purchases?

Thanks

Glynn
That made me laugh a bit. I learned on my Information Evening that nobody apparently ever buys Standard points. Either they buy on the night, or they're never seen again!

Anyway, my understanding is that preimier points remain as premier points. Be aware that transfers can only happen to other WorldMark unitholders. Giving points to non-unitholders is "renting" and doesn't involve WorldMark. So, I guess as long as the transferer and transferee are both Premier Owners, the points would remain as such.

The fact that Trendwest has final say probably means that they'd block transfers in strange situations where somebody appears to be taking advantage of the system, or where it is causing a disadvantage to Trendwest themselves. My advice -- keep a low profile!

Does anybody else have some advice or experience on this topic? If so, hit the comment link below!

-- Fabbo.

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Another "information evening" story

This story was left by a reader in the comments section, but I'm repeating it here for people reading via newsfeeds...

I just got back from a TrendWest presentation in SLC, UT USA. It seems that the owner of this blog is in Australia but neverless, the presentation sounded almost identical. The only difference is that instead of using ICE for international travel we would use a company called RCI.

In my case TrendWest acquired my information by holding a $50,000 sweepstakes that I entered into at a professional sports event. They called me twice to 'verify my sweepstakes entrance information.' These calls were turned out to be qualifying questions to be sure that I was who I said I was and to qualify my purchasing power. They then called a third time and informed me that I hadn't won the $50,000 prize but I had won a 'mini-vaction' and all I needed to do was come down to their offices and pick it up! Then they proceeded to tell me that I would also need to sit through a 90 minute presentation... Ah ha! The catch!

After I finally figured out that I hadn't really won anything and this was just another timeshare scheme to get people in the door I almost cancelled, but I thought 'heck, I'll give it a try.' Huge mistake!

When I arrived at the office I was sat down in a waiting room with other supposed 'winners' and waited to be let into the presentation room. We then watched a short movie about Cendant and TrendWest followed by introductions to our sales reps. This part was very interesting because I noticed that the women reps all were assigned to men that were there by themselves, which didn't really seem too odd until the flirting began. These women were pros! They would softly touch my arm or shoulder any opportunity they could and also tell me how 'sweet' I was. Very weird... The rep proceeded to explain in very convincing detail how I would be saving thousands of dollars over hotel prices and how I would have 'ownership' in the property. Immediately I started drawing parallels of this presentation with the traditional high-pressure car sale, complete with scribblings on the offer sheet and the ultimate closer - 'getting the manager.'

By this time I was totally annoyed. Both the sales rep and manager tried and tried to convince me that this was an investment but how could it be? I know for a fact that timeshare's don't resell for more than their original price and they are also income draining investments due to the maintainance fees. The question that I kept asking is 'how did you come up with this price($20,600)?' It was rediculous, they had no answer... My argument was that the price was too high and there was no real value to it because you never really own it, at least not like you would true real estate. The manager got visibly agitated because I wasn't buying the sales pitch and began to feverishly defend the value being quoted and tried to bait and switch me to a lesser plan because in his words I 'obviously couldn't afford the premium plan.' Bizarre! I never said anything about not being able to afford it, I just said I wanted to know how they came up with the price. At one point I said I felt like I was in a car dealership, at which the manager got very upset and defensive, claiming not to be a 'scummy car dealer.' I rolled my eyes to his comment and he demanded that I not roll my eyes at him! I couldn't believe it! He was scolding me like I was a child! At this time the table got very quiet and a staredown ensued. It was very uncomfortable... I thought that I might be in for an actual punch-down drag-out fight. Then he made a comment something like 'just get him his free gift' and immediately left.

The whole experience was sooooo crazy! After the incident with the manager the sales rep tried to get me to refer some friends for her to call and I just laughed. NO WAY! The sales rep was actually fairly friendly and I felt like she was as up front as she could be considering the whole thing is inherently very shady, but the more I think about it the more I realize she was just a small part of the grander deceptive scheme.

Overall I lost any interest in dealing with them directly. I would consider buying a resale TrendWest timeshare but I still don't quite understand how one gets out of it. If there is no time limit does that mean you have to pay the maintainance fee even if you're 100 yrs old and don't holiday anymore?

Regardless, I felt obligated to share my story so that no other innocent people would have to deal with the 'Wrath of the Car Dealer!'
Yes, that's a good question to ask -- how do they come up with the price? While costs would certainly contribute (including sales commissions), it's really a matter of "what the market can bear". A higher price might generate less sales, but the extra money is pure profit! Even though units used to be cheaper (under $1.50), it doesn't mean you're getting anything more for the higher price.

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Latest auctions & news

Hi folks,

I had somebody chat to me over the water fountain the other day, asking me if I knew anything about the Accor Premiere Vacation Club. He had received a written invitation to attend an information seminar, with an offer of hoidays or a DVD player to attend. Looked pretty much like a Trendwest invitation -- same tactics, similar offer.

It still beats me why people pay retail for these things. eBay auction #6525366909 has 6000 credits going for a starting bid of $8000, and "buy it now" of $9000. Not the best, but $1.33 - $1.50 is still better than $2.08!

Two auctions recently ended with successful sales. #6516820409 and #6518673694 both finished close to $1/unit -- congratulations to the purchasers!

I spent some time at the WMOwners website where I asked US WorldMark unitholders whether it would be possible to "rent" some points off owners for use on ICE cruises. I didn't get a definitive answer, but there was some interest. That would be an excellent way to get cheap cruises, and make a WorldMark unitholder happy by purchasing their unused points for a year (effecitvely financing their annual levy for that year).

One thing's for sure -- the WMOwners forum, run by unitholders rather than Trendwest/WorldMark themselves, is a boon for unitholders. It makes things so easy to buy, sell, rent and trade. Using the Internet to create free markets!

-- Fabbo


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Monday, April 04, 2005

Unfortunately misunderstanding

A while back I made reference to an eBay auction that had the price horribly wrong.

The listing was for:

6000 time share credits at AU$2.10/credit. Trendwest to assist in transfer of ownership
The starting auction price was set at $2.10 -- obviously meaning "price per unit".

However, the bidding then went:

targatours ( 5 )$5.00
bobd2512 ( 0 )$6.50
alfewre ( 3 )$10.00
bobd2512 ( 0 )$12.50
bobd2512 ( 0 )$97.50
dino.t ( 24)$101.05
dino.t ( 24)$111.05
bobd2512 ( 0 )$113.55

Quite obviously, this bidding was incorrect and getting out of control -- nobody would pay $113.55/unit of WorldMark!

I wrote to the bidder and here's what they said:

hi!

it seemed like that - most of them thought that i was sellng the whole 6000 credits for $2.10, when it's clearly stated on my ad that it's for a membership with 6000 credits at $2.10/credit.

Just not happy with the service they'd given me. If I were you, if you don't intend to go on holidays every year for life, don't become a member. it is very attractive, but
sometimes things happen and you cannot afford this sort of luxury and it leaves you no option but to withdraw ownership. In my experience, it is not an easy step, since i put the credits on mortgage (if you paid for the total price upfront, no problem).
Because Trendwest does not do resale, it is the responsibility of the member to sell
his/her membership in order to pay out the finance. There's no way that you'd be able to recover the amount outstanding on the loan. You woud be out of pocket like me by approx $1500.

Anyway, to each his own. People have different priorities.

Goodluck on your website
I wonder whether it eventually sold?!

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A good deal now online

Found this one currently listed on eBay...
  • 6000 units
  • Opening price $6,000
  • 775 current credits
Interestingly, here are some comments from the seller, geoffrox77, about the resorts and reasons for selling:

Q: Hello What are the Trendwest facilities like? How many have you been to? Does your membership include the European / UK destinations? Have you been a member for long and why are you selling?

A: Hi David, Trendwest has resorts in Australia,Fiji, NZealand,USA,Hawaii.We have stayed in Cairns (Nth Qld), Golden Beach (Sunshine Coast,Qld) & Kirra Beach (Gold Coast,Qld) The resorts have been lovely.

We've had family & overseas visitors with us on several occasions & all have been suitably impressed. We had the opport of a London visit as well. This was organised thru Interval International which links our membership to resorts throughtout the world. To be a member of Interval Internation the cost is $95.00/year, $209.00/3 years, or $290.00/5 years. Well worth $ spent. For more information on these destinations go to www.intervalworld.com, and look under their Resort Directory. You'll see the variety of countries available.

Apart from this Trendwest now has their own travel club which means you can stay at places that are not owned by Worldmark. They also organise club escapades for day or evening events.

We have been happy members since 2001 & are selling purely for cashflow reasons.
Selling at half-price wouldn't help that Return on Investment!

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Timeshare Resales Australia

The Timeshare Resales Australia site is a local Australian resource for listing run by Dawn Arnold in Victoria. It is a listing service for various timeshares throughout Australia.

Those interested in WorldMark South Pacific should look under the "Other" listings, where current listings include:
  • 8000 units for $10,500 + 5000 credits (recently sold)
  • 7000 units for $11,500 + 7000 credits
  • 7000 units for $10,000 + 14,250 credits (Wow, they don't use it much, eh?)
  • 7000 units for $10,500 + 7000 credits
  • 7000 units for $12,000 + 7000 credits
  • 6000 units for $10,900
  • 6000 units for $8,400 + 1000 credits (why didn't this sell first?)
  • 6000 units for $9,000 + 9350 credits
  • 6000 units for $9,000 + 1000 credits
  • 6000 units for $8,200 + 8000 credits
That's quite a few listings, but they tend to sit there for a long time whereas eBay auctions only last for up to 10 days.

I tend to think that you could always do a deal with these people to close a transaction quickly! Or, approach them to "rent" some points and they'd probably be happy -- especially if some points are about to expire! E-mail contacts are provided on the site.
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